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Controversial Opinions Thread: The R.E.M. Thread for sensible people who are also idiots

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  • TTKTTK
    edited September 2015
    alright well here's another one, this might be a little more divisive.

    There's an Australian girl with Down Syndrome, and she aspires to be a model.
    And she is getting to live that dream, she is going to talk down the catwalk at New York Fashion Week.

    People say she is redefining what beauty can and cannot be, and all that stuff, inspirational story, follow your dreams, etc.

    But I don't know... I feel she's getting all of this attention because she has down syndrome, not necessarily because she is trying to be a model.
    It just seems like a bunch of sympathy hand outs, I don't even know if she has the cognitive faculties to really process what's going on. I tried to look around for an interview but everything is being said by her Mum.

    I'm not for discrimination, and I'm not putting her down, I'm just a little weirded out. What about those who don't have intellectual disabilities and aren't the best looking people. Can they be models just because they want to?
    Part of me says not to worry about it, but another part of me does worry. I just don't want her to set her sights too high, only for everything to come crashing down once the sympathy train runs out.
  • It's a hard thing to admit but I agree with that
  • yeah the question of how something ended up getting to you is just as valid as the question of is it good
  • edited September 2015
    I mean the fact that Barack Obama was black probably actually helped him become president. The fact that some people voted for him (in the primary especially) because he was black doesn't take away from the monumentalness of the achievement that being the first black president is.

    It's impossible to swing the pendulum the other way without over swinging a bit. I would say voting for a black candidate on principle is better than voting against a black candidate on principle. Even though the first is weird in its own way, it's a neccesary step at achieving acceptance because nobody breaks the status quo by accident.
  • "Probably actually helped him"
    I mean i hate fox news just as much as the next guy, but probably is kind of an understatement lol
  • I think the whole fashion model industry ideally shouldn't exist, at least in the way it is now more about advertising than self expression. I think people trying to sell us on the idea that everyone can be beautiful have noble intentions but are missing the mark. They are right in one sense, that this is ultimately a subjective thing. But making ugliness itself an impossibility is a problem because the focus should be on making people understand that beauty doesn't matter, it's ephemeral and not fulfilling in and of itself.
  • noble intentions and missing the mark is arguable the worst thing ever
  • noble intentions in the streets, missing the mark in the sheets
  • president is also a more important position than model.
  • well actually i disagree with myself there but thats neither here nor there
  • edited September 2015
    @secondplanet- yeah that's fair. idk I guess I wish it wasn't in the modeling context though because like I said I have reservations about that stuff in general. more valuable in getting the message across would be with fictional characters, not focusing on the value of their prettiness, and not in a Very Special Episode either, but regular cast members who deal with these things and face difficulties but are supported by their friends and oh goddammit this is going to turn into me saying "Glee" is somehow a good show and that's not what I want, that's not what anyone wants
    there's a guy on America's Next Top Model this season who is deaf and he's pretty cool and I hope he wins
  • edited September 2015
    I don't know guys, models inform our standard of beauty as much as our standard of beauty informs models. I think it's essential for media to give historically marginalized groups real and meaningful role-models and to help break down stereotypes. I don't know the specific case, so maybe there is some sort of tokenism going on but think about how meaningful this would be to other people with Down syndrome? It's totally weird in its own way and I don't deny that but I do think when you tally it up that it does more good than harm.

    Nobody is arguing that organic representation isn't better than forced representation but I would argue that forced representation is better than no representation. any change to the status quo will be seen as "forced" by someone, I think it's just important to keep pushing boundaries in all forms of media until the day that a more diverse media is sustainable.

    And don't get me wrong, tokenism does suck. If tokenism becomes the standard and then we don't transition to a more organic final state, then yes that is problematic however I think considering that we've only been entering in this socially conscious media thing for like maybe a decade that we have a LONG way to go before we've swung up the other side of the pendulum.
  • edited September 2015
    I'm sure it was seen as forced by some people when Beverly Johnson appeared as the first black model on the cover of vogue, but if you don't "force" it the first time then it'll never happen
  • http://m.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/544/batman

    This talks about this blind guy who became a media sensation by being able to ride a bike via echo-location. It talks about how he hated the way the media treated him like some sort of spectacle but also how ultimately it also enables him to change people's expectations about what blind people could do and get the opportunity to go around and help other blind kids learn to echo-locate. Media spectacle is gross without a doubt, but maybe it's a neccesary evil to initiate wider change?
  • this is only controversial inasmuch as you're a fan of hot chip, but "boy from school" is the best hot chip song and it's not close
  • I'd agree.
  • idm is a stupid name for a genre
  • so is sludge metal and a variety of metal sub genres mind you
  • edited September 2015
    idm is definitely stupid, but i guess we're stuck with it. and i'm kind of fine with it since it partially originated from a warp compilation
  • i don't like it because it implies that other forms of dance music are dumb
  • yeah. that's the problem. maybe it can become like the SAT and not actually stand for anything anymore haha. just IDM.
  • I dislike most genre tags.
  • edited September 2015
    IDM is bad for multiple reasons:

    1. it implies dance music is dumb

    2. it implies that syncopation means intelligent

    3. how the FUCK are you supposed to dance to that shit?
  • Dance music is kinda dumb, like as a concept.

    IDM is dumber though.
  • hey mark
  • Ugh, this was one of those things when I didn't see a new page was there and then replied to the last comment on the previous page with that gif. 
  • I dunno why we kept 30 posts a page... I think we all just got used to it.
  • i only listen to socially conscious IDM
  • @hedgeway You're beyond stink!
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